The Toybox

people for the conservation of limited amounts of indignation


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children of dune - leto 1
seperis
Livejournal Advisory Board Election is up and running.

I--you know, here's the thing. After what happened with Brad, I just, personally, cannot take this seriously as anything but a titular--thing.

...though from comments in that post, it is being taken Very Seriously Indeed.

Hands up--who even noticed the elections? I discovered it while skimming sf-d THEN saw one person on my flist represent.

...I'm not even sure who the candidates are. Except Jameth seems to be doing really well, and his campaign posters are awesome.

lordandrei is an old friend of mine, so he's my first choice. I endorse him heartily.

FWIW, all the candidates' platforms are linked here.

Jameth seems to be a notorious troll, who's in it for the lulz. He's also evidently the kind of guy who thinks it's really funny for his supporters to use rapidly-flashing "seizure the moment" icons which can actually trigger photosensitive epilepsy. Because, you know, that's LOLarious.

legomymalfoy and rm are both fannish and both seem to have a good rep as competent and thoughtful; squeaky19 is Squeaky of InsaneJournal.

I don't have high hopes that the user reps will be listened to at all, given how little attention LJ pays to the existing Advisory Board, but I'd imagine that a win for a joke or troll candidate pretty much guarantees that users' interests will be ignored.

Huh. I read jameth's platform. If he's a troll, he's arguing he's not pretty hard.

I don't have high hopes that the user reps will be listened to at all, given how little attention LJ pays to the existing Advisory Board, but I'd imagine that a win for a joke or troll candidate pretty much guarantees that users' interests will be ignored.

I'm just not convinced the job *is* anything. And it seemed like such a good idea att.

He can argue all he wants, but at the very best, his actions and history will kill even the tiniest chance that LJ would take this position seriously. As rydra_wong says, I suspect that his victory will give LJ the excuse to claim that clearly, we're not serious about having a voice.

At the very worst, I'd say whatever arguments he makes are pretty well undercut by the use of campaign icons specifically designed to cause people physical harm. That's not a joke. That's malice.

(Sorry, didn't mean to go off. Seeing that vote is not helping my faith in humanity today.)

*thoughtful* You know. It might help if the second highest, legomymalfoy, got more votes. Hmm.

She's been gaining on him in the last few hours, I note. And I've heard a lot of good stuff about her.

If he's a troll, he's arguing he's not pretty hard.

Personally, I have to say that the icons disincline me to give him the benefit of the doubt on that.

I was diagnosed with mild epilepsy in the last year, and have no idea what triggers it in my case, so I'm just not really down with the sort of people who apparently think this sort of shit is funny.

No, I read about that in news and in s-f, so yes, that was indefensible. I just didn't known he was a part of it.

Hmm.

I honestly don't know if he had anything to do with the Epilepsy Foundation website incident or not.

But the icons work on exactly the same principle and could potentially have the same effect, as well as making a nasty joke out of the whole thing.

Edited at 2008-05-23 04:48 pm (UTC)

He had nothing to do with that, and legomymalfoy also has a rapidly blinking seizure inducing icon. Nice that you've preemptively banned a significant portion of Jameth's flist from commenting in your journal so that others can spread false accusations like that. Jameth didn't create the icons, he asked people to stop using them when others complained, and legomymalfoy has a rapidly blinking seizure inducing icon of her own, but Jameth is the bad guy. Right.

Out of 1300 something fof, it was less than twentyish, I think. That is not a significant number.

...you realize this post was made on Friday? In internet time, last year. There are many, many communities discussing the icon, including the election page and jameth's response to it.

She's making the same comment on every post that mentions the icons.

Clearly LMM, who has a single blinking icon and who hasn't swarmed any epileptic's LJs with them after being asked not to, is just as rude and obnoxious as... oh, wait. Never mind.

For some really bizarre reason, at least earlier today, when you put in seperis, this is the second post that shows up.

I have no idea why.

If he's a troll, he's arguing he's not pretty hard.

I'm pretty much certain that his so-called 'IRL credentials' are made up.

He's been involved in LJ Drama, Encyclopedia Dramatica, and the Frienditto thing (don't know if you remember that, but it involved tricking LJ users into revealing information about themselves, then posting that information in public) among other things. He's not someone who has the best interests of LJ users at heart.

Define involved in? Because the creators and runners of those things have pretty much said that his involvement, at best, was extremely limited.

And I'm pretty much certain that his IRL credentials are actually *not* made up as he has people from off the internet willing to verify them, and has made efforts to verify some of them already. I'm aware that this is an old comment, but I just saw it.

Was it google? Now I'm curious, considering the age of this post comparatively speaking.

That led me to this post? I'm not sure if that's what you meant, but I'll answer that - if it's not, let me know what you did mean instead :)

Someone linked to your post, I believe, for whatever reason. There is so much crosslinking and rallying going on revolving around this election that I no longer can keep track of who said what where.

Heh. Yes, sorry, I was doing something else while typing and left out an entire group of words.

For the record: I know a *lot* of the stuff going around at this time is basically in the family of hearsay. This post was fairly early on and I'll be honest, I still don't know the ins and outs of what he did and did not do. And I kind of suspect, at this point, that I never will. I don't have any crossover in flist or friends with any of jameth's supporters, so--yeah.

The problem is, well, yes, with him, but more with the intial responses to legomymalfoy starting to gain votes, well before she took the lead. I was tracking the election journal from around eleven o'clock AM on Friday and the response of SOCKPUPPET before the furiosity screencap was deeply irritating and went downhill from there. When on a daily basis people on my flist are attacked or trolled (or what happened to rydra-wong), the candidate gets lost in that and it's hard to separate the candidate from the people trolling. The references to legomymalfoy in terms I am really uncomfortable with regarding her sexuality and gender didn't help either. And it degenerated from there from both sides.

I don't think it's fair, though, not to any of the candidates.

I admit I missed a lot of this - I only got really involved recently in response to hat I feel is a candidate who will not best represent Livejournal as a whole, let alone fandom (I can't speak to the needs of fandom in its entirety, but at the same time, some of the words and actions of LMM leave me dubious nonetheless).

As for the accusations of puppetry - if it came before there was evidence, did it also come before people were reporting it from their "sources"? Surely this could be manufactured (my source just told me that this guy Brad who founded livejournal is actually George Bush!!!!), but given that proof followed in fairly short order, I'd have to wonder. Now, if it came without any mention of potential puppetry and was just a counter to an increase in popularity - that's another matter and I'd be interested in hearing about it.

I don't know what happened to rydra-wrong: the only context that name has come up for me is in discussion of misinformation she spread about Jameth, and myabe (my memory is bad) taht she was deleting or screening comments - but I can't speak to that in definite terms. I know that supporters of Jameth tend to go to places as they're discovered en masse, with varying degrees of politeness in their tactics.

I think that unfortunate actions have been taken in support of both leading candidates, and that neither group of supporters is above reproach. But also, that if we're to hold one accountable for their supporter's actions (even if they ask said supporters to stop) that has to be the standard.

My apologies; I had to go and walk through the threads to make sure I was correct. I can only speak for myself and what I followed Friday.

The accusation came before the first posted screencap.

2008-05-23 06:11 pm UTC First mention of disqualificatoin of lego for being on LJ Abuse
2008-05-23 06:40 pm UTC Camber made a 500 sockpuppet anonymous source comment.
2008-05-23 07:39 pm UTC User points out that this might be how lego got into second place.
2008-05-23 10:41 pm UTC Sockpuppet accusation by jameth in his lj
2008-05-23 10:53 pm UTC Implication of sockpuppetry by legos
2008-05-23 11:35 pm UTC Claim of rumor of 200 sockpuppet journals
2008-05-23 11:48 pm UTC Another implication of sockpuppetry
2008-05-24 01:10 am UTC Screencap of furiosity's LJ, showing two people talking about sockpuppets in a cap from 2008-05-23 03:14 pm UTC
2008-05-24 01:19 am UTC second appearance of screencap.
2008-05-24 01:28 am UTC accusation shows up in clairvoyant wank
2008-05-24 04:22 am UTC 200 sockpuppet allegation, sf-drama

I was tracking voting at the time:
Jameth - Legomymalfoy
2:02 PM CST = 1573 to 1156
2:15 PM CST = 1582 to 1187
2:21 PM CST = 1585 to 1197
(these are set between 2:21 and 3:12, but unknown precise minute)
(1590 to 1212)
(1604 to 1245)
3:12 PM CST = 1611 to 1266
3:30 PM CST = 1621 to 1295
3:39 PM CST = 1622 to 1301
3:48 PM CST = 1631 to 1313
4:00 PM CST = 1636 to 1331
4:18 PM CST = 1638 to 1353
4:20 PM CST = 1641 to 1357
4:30 PM CST = 1643 to 1365

Posts for the election started showing up on my flist late Thursday night/early Friday morning declaring for lego, which set off a chain reaction through flists. I made my first post at 11:01 CST, my second at 12:40 when I declared for a candidate. According to what I have sketched down here, between the six posts I saw before 12:40, including rydra-wong's, and the explosion after one o'clock, when I started watching the comm, potentially four to five thousand people read the message regarding the election from approximately twenty-two posts made between one AM CST and one PM CST on May 23 that I saw personally (I know others were made and have seen referenced, but I don't really want to go back and retroactively count, so ones like furiosity's et al I'm not counting for the purpose of this conversation).

(This is very approximate; I had to estimate my fof and potential dead accounts/filters against the other people's and our overlap. It's a estimate due to a lot of people also having feeds to their ljs for friends in IJ and GJ.)

There are several gaps due to retroactive flock that I don't have access to, unfortunately.

This isn't an indictment, because I wasn't documenting at the time as thoroughly as I would have if I'd known what I was seeing; however, it felt suspicious, especially to those of us watching the numbers, at how quickly the sockpuppet translated to lego translated to 200 and beyond when lego started to gain votes. The proof of the cap was posted to verify two people, not 200. Abruptly, before most of us had even gotten farther than a fairly passive legomymalfoy vote, our posts were being trolled and flamed. That kinda put everyone in a sour mood.

Again, I say *looked* suspicious. There are a hundred reasons it could have gone the way it did and I'm not going to make accusations of deliberate malice because I'm not convinced there *was* malice.

*searches for an adjective*

*settles on "impressed"*

Wow. This is ... really thorough. Adding 2c.

- Jameth posted on the 23rd at 15:40:00 UTC here that Legomymalfoy, his closest competitor, was getting sockpuppet votes.

- I recorded the standings on the 23rd at at 16:56:00 UTC at the bottom of the post here. "Jameth has 1725 votes. Legomymalfoy has 1553 votes. No one else is even in the ball park."

- Within hours of his accusation, that total had risen (in the same post): "And now... Jameth has 1877 votes and Legomymalfoy has 2124."


is in discussion of misinformation she spread about Jameth

Rydra made a post in which she pointed out that the use of fast-blinking icons with the motto "seizure the day" was less than funny for someone who had recently been diagnosed as epileptic. She found this problematic, and possibly dangerous, since it's impossible to always know exactly what triggers seizures.

Jameth and his supporters swarmed her LJ, using those blinky-blinky icons, mocking her and demanding scientific proof that their icons could hurt anyone. This included Jameth, although he later went back and edited the blinky icon out of his comment. She's since locked down her entire LJ because they would not stop harrassing her.

I don't know whether icons can trigger seizures. But that kind of behavior on its own is enough for me to know who I'm voting against.

Rydra didn't spread any disinformation. She expressed her opinion and was stampeded for it.

I would define "involved in" as "participated in OR was a member of AND endorsed".

This is an old comment, I have since done a bit of research myself and wish to withdraw my comments regarding his IRL credentials being made up. I'm not certain that he has participated in all of the things he says he has, since I have not seen definite proof, but on the balance of things I do not wish to accuse him of deliberately lying.

I still have many concerns about his actual commitment to LJ - especially as he has not denied that he had some involvement in LJ Drama, etc. I'm also not certain that his credentials actually have relevance - I mean, I have experience of being on advisory boards, but that doesn't qualify me to sit on LJ's.

OTOH, legomymalfoy's connections to LJ Abuse make me worry she'll represent the Abuse Team, not the users. That, and the silence she's maintained throughout have me concerned, and I may end up voting for someone else (vichan has impressed me).

If you feel Jameth is not the candidate for you, I've found vichan to be a very good alternate who also will definitely listen to fandom if that is a concern of yours. I'd also put Deathboy out there, but I don't feel like he has a fighting chance anymore.

I see your point about relevance, but feel that any advisory board period is more and better experience for the position than what many bring to the table.

Yes, I think it's vichan for me.

Unfortunate really - everyone seems to like her, but she's very far behind in the first place voting (which is really the only place that matters which we can see). She's comported herself with dignity throughout and made friends in all camps, which is more than I can say of any other leading candidate.

Yikes, I should have heeded that warning and not clicked on his platform out of curiosity, these pink/green flashing graphics have given me a headache even though I don't have epilepsy. That's worse than bad fluorescent lights.

You're aware that legomymalfoy also has a rapidly blinking seizure inducing icon, right?

Has legomymalfoy been using her blinkie icon (which is not "seizure inducing" unless you know of a specific medical incident) in the campaign? Has she been encouraging other people to use it in the election discussions?

The issue isn't "annoying, headache-inducing, possibly seizure-inducing icons." It's deliberately using them widely in places where you don't know the readership, knowing they could cause problems for some people.

I didn't know it. I've never seen her use it, much less abuse it.

I noticed, I do make it a point to keep an eye on at least one or two of the main LJ news centers and it was announced in the news at least once, I don't think it's a coincidence that the herald took a vacation THIS week. I'd have to check and see if their vacation extends through the end of the election.

FWIW, jameth is allegedly part of the group that was putting the seizure-inducing comments on the epilepsy websites "for lulz".

You're aware that legomymalfoy also has a rapidly blinking seizure inducing icon, right?

... don't you have anything else to talk about?

Seriously.


No, I didn't know that. You know why I didn't know that?

Because she's never attacked anyone with it.

rydra_wong has been posting on the elections, so I've been somewhat informed.

I'm not impressed by Jameth, in part because I think anyone legitimately running for a board should have an LJ page that doesn't physically hurt to read. Not everyone has Firefox or greasemonkey scripts available. I suspect I'll be voting for rm, who seems eminently sensible and is an actual fangirl to boot.

Definitely not voting for the Tron guy, whichever that one is, since he thinks that gender and racial diversity are merely concepts brought up by trouble-makers, not worthy of addressing seriously.

Hmmm. I heard about it when first announced, but I was waiting for things to shape up a bit before I got involved.

I've actually seen cambler a few times on photography communities - he's a professional photographer and does what I would consider tasteful, but sexual female nude photography with a mild kink element to it.

Decisions, decisions.

I like rm's page. It shows good coherence and thoughtfulness. legomymalfoy's page is not bad... and I like that she's very passionate, but it's less succinct.

...I'm not even sure who the candidates are.
Me neither. :( Someone on my flist should have submitted her candidacy, because at least I know them and what they stand for.

I got the email from LJ and checked them out.

But erm. Was that your sarcastic voice, or ... did you see different campaign posters than I did? 'Cause I really want to unsee several of them, and the rest just irritated me. 'Course it's all a matter of taste.

I felt sort of bad voting for my choices (which you can see if you check my LJ), 'cause I think whoever wins, if they're really trying to do something good, they're going to be frustrated at every turn.

Never the less, I took it seriously and voted seriously. Just in case.

Doesn't look like it's going to do any good for me though, 'cause Jameth is winning by quite a lot, and I'm head-desking 'cause he makes my brain twitch.

He's only ahead by 180ish lsat check, nad that's a huge change from noon, when he was ahead by about four or five hundred. fandom_votes was set up by Madelyn to study the candidates better, if you're interested. *g*

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